New Testament Church Proliferation Digest

Spreading the Gospel via House Churches

Sept 26, 2001 Vol 01 : 069

NT Church Proliferation Digest Wednesday, September 26 2001 Vol 01 : 069

[ntcp] Intro
Re: [ntcp] Intro
[ntcp] quakers
re: [ntcp] quakers
Re: [ntcp] Intro

Date: Mon, 24 Sep 2001 15:28:09 -0700
From: "Michael Clark"
Subject: [ntcp] Intro

My name is Michael Clark. I have been married to Dorothy for over 35 years
and have known the Lord almost as long. We are empty nesters and live on
forty wooded acres in northern Idaho. We have four married kids and seven
grand kids who range from Houston, TX to Bellingham, WN.

Dorothy works as a technical writer for a local software firm and I work as
an electrician for a military contractor that supports submarine acoustical
testing on a nearby lake. My job is part time which allows me to find time
to write. Lately I have been co-writing articles about the body of Christ
and what we feel the Spirit is saying to the Churches with George Davis,
who has grown to be a dear friend that lives only 35 minutes away. He is a
rare find in this back woodsy country, believe me.

Some other of our friends that you might know are Nate and Joanne Krupp,
Jay Ferris, Jack Russell, and Wayne Jacobson. Many of the folks on HCtalk,
New Wineskin, HCC, etc. we have met first hand and others are internet
family in Christ.

If you want a detailed view of my testimony in Christ and want to see some
family pictures they are on our web site. I will be lurking for a while and
trying to get the feel of what this list is about.

Love in Christ,

Michael Clark
"Who is this that is coming up from the wilderness, Leaning upon her
Beloved?" "Set me as a seal upon your heart, As a seal upon your arm."
(Song of Solomon 8:5,6)

"A Wilderness Voice"

------- <><><> -------

Date: Tue, 25 Sep 2001 08:29:18 -0400
From: "Dan Beaty"
Subject: Re: [ntcp] Intro


Thanks for the introduction. It is always encouraging to learn how the
Lord's work is being accomplished in SE Asian countries by those of you are
equipped and sent by Him!

Thanks also for calling our attention back to the primary purpose of this
list. After having spent several years reading and participating on
Christian email lists, I can tell you that this is a common necessity. When
people come together from so many backgrounds, it is difficult to resist
discussing the differences, becoming sidetracked.

If you read all the postings at the time, you might have noticed that you
were not the only one disapointed to read that some felt the Great
Commission was not relevant to us today. These are some of the issues that
we are strangely faced with from time to time.

But I would suggest that those who have specific subjects relating to
practical issues in church planting start the discussions. Just keep in mind
that the concerns of church planters in SE Asia might at times be different
than those in N America or Europe.

Even then, there is so much we can learn from one another. I for one was
fascinated by your daily teaching of the Old Testament, in preparation for
the Gospel to these 70 people for three months.

While twice in India during brief visits, I found that the people were very
open to "foundation laying," even the believers. But here in the US, where
many are saved by the preaching of the New Testament, people often are too
impatient, or fail to see the value of our foundations in the Old Testament.

How did you go about getting this started?

Dan Beaty
Columbus, Ohio USA

------- <><><> -------

Date: Tue, 25 Sep 2001 08:13:28 -0400
From: "vanessadd"
Subject: [ntcp] quakers

Any opinions on quakers?


------- <><><> -------

Date: 25 Sep 2001 18:45:48 +0100
Subject: re: [ntcp] quakers

I don't know about America but in the U.K. they are VERY HUMANIST, many believe that Evangelical Christians are Cranks (Perhaps we are). One couple I know have completly disowned their evangelical Christian daughter (a co-worker of mine), whilst actively lauding their radically homosexual son. I think to sum up that the Quakers have somewhat left their Christian roots. The make great friends though (Sorry, bad joke).


------- <><><> -------

Date: Wed, 26 Sep 2001 15:57:17 +0200
From: "Deborah"
Subject: Re: [ntcp] Intro

Paul McIlwain wrote:

> When I was given the contact email address for this particular

> discussion group (which includes "New Testament church planting"

> in its name) I quickly subscribed because I hoped that this might be

> a forum for discussion and a source of some insights which would help

> in my Church Planting consultancy work. I also moderate another (much smaller,

> in-house) Church Planting discussion group and I had hoped that there might be

> some good postings on this New Testament Church Proliferation group of yours which I could pass

> on to our other group.

> I don't know you all, and after 4 months of reading contributions, I

> have very little idea of the kinds of ministries you're involved in.

> I admit that I'm remiss for not having written before, but I have been
> waiting for some issue to surface which would have practical value in

> the work of church planting so that I could introduce myself in a

> response .... Again, not knowing who all subscribes to this group,

> I don't want to be judgemental, but it does appear that the issues

> you concentrate on have little direct bearing on the things I face day
> in day out.

Brother Paul (... if you're still there), in order to kind of
introduce myself in response to your statement that you don't know us or
what ministries we're involved in, I am a gentile Christian working with
an established Messianic congregation in the heart of Jerusalem, Israel
doing evangelism and discipleship; not church planting per se, although
one day, we hope, it will lead to that. My family's ministry here is
partially supported by interested parties/churches in the U.S. and
partly supported by my wife's librarian job at Jerusalem University
College-- a small Christian institution on modern-day Mt. Zion. Our
Jerusalem congregation-- not directly affiliated with the college-- is
also a research organization which provides commentaries and other
educational materials to the worldwide Messianic community and
interested gentile Christians. I meagerly contribute to this aspect of
our congregation's teaching ministry along with my other duties. As you
can see, my specialty is not so "practical" in specific respect to
church planting but rather focuses on the biblical/theological
underpinning of Messianic ministry and beliefs. However, since this
listserve was named the "_New Testament_ Church Planting" list and I
naturally have a vital interest in the theology of the global mission
enterprise itself, I felt like I still had a niche from which to make
contributions-- particularly in guiding our "practical" and theoretical
discussions back to the Scriptures in order to gauge our church planting
and maintainance efforts by God's revelation, ... which if one thinks
about it a certain way, in turn, becomes very "practical". I've also
gained perspective from the posts on this list in several matters,
particularly the modern HC movement. This has stretched my paradigm and
certainly affects present (and future) ministry.

I've breezed through our introductions, so now I'd like to ask a
few questions of you. Not wanting to defend the status quo, but also
wanting to direct constructive criticism in all directions, I would ask
of you the following:

1) If New Testament Church Proliferation has failed to provide your smaller Church Planting discussion group with
"good postings," would it be possible to share some of your group's
material with us?

2) Could you give us one or two examples of what you mean by an "issue
... which ha[s] practical value in the work of church planting" so we
could all benefit from and gain insight into your perspective?

3) On a more personal level, and in reference to your observation that
"... the issues [we] concentrate on have little direct bearing on the
things [you] face day in day out," could it be that the issues which
confront you are so unique to your particular context that they don't
have universal application, and/or -- to hit at your statement from a
different angle-- could what you are facing "day in day out" be so far
removed from _New Testament_ church planting that you see no practical
value in _any_ of our discussions? In other words-- and to use my
experiences and personal perspective to help clarify my meaning-- what I
was taught in college on church planting, and what I often read in EMQ,
IBMR, and other publications and books sees NT _principles_ as
important, but not so much NT _paradigms_. Social science theory
becomes the primary lenses through which we're encouraged to interpret
God's holy book. Some specific commands and scriptural models are
relegated to the past since-- so we're told-- they don't apply in the
modern world, in a tribal context, among X people group, etc. Is this
your approach as well brother Paul, and could that be one reason why
_none_ of our posts have appeared "practical" to you?



End of New Testament Church Proliferation Digest V1 #69

house church eldership servanthood lord's day lord's supper world missions